Which Is More Important For President Jr-Siding With The Insurgents Or The US Troops?
If the new Govt of Iraqi PM Maliki doesn't formally press for the extradition of US troops accused of War Crimes against Iraqi Civilians, there's still a BIG problem heading for the self-professed "War President"
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Iraq Amnesty Plan May Cover Attacks On U.S. Military
Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki on Wednesday proposed a limited amnesty to help end the Sunni Arab insurgency as part of a national reconciliation plan that Maliki said would be released within days. The plan is likely to include pardons for those who had attacked only U.S. troops, a top adviser said.
Maliki's declaration of openness to talks with some members of Sunni armed factions, and the prospect of pardons, are concessions that previous, interim governments had avoided. The statements marked the first time a leader from Iraq's governing Shiite religious parties has publicly embraced national reconciliation, welcomed dialogue with armed groups and proposed a limited amnesty.
Reconciliation could include an amnesty for those "who weren't involved in the shedding of Iraqi blood," Maliki told reporters at a Baghdad news conference. "Also, it includes talks with the armed men who opposed the political process and now want to turn back to political activity."
*************************
Maliki's security crackdown and talk of amnesty and reconciliation came a day after President Bush's unannounced visit to Baghdad's heavily fortified Green Zone. Bush came with what he said were twin messages for Maliki: The United States would not abandon Iraq, but Iraq needed to do more to tackle its problems.
And one of the big problems Maliki has been forced to respond to are numerous instances of Iraqi civilians being killed, wrongly or deliberately, by US forces.
Maliki has insisted that Iraq will conduct it's own investigations into these incidents, and one reason for that is as a way to undercut the simmering and explicit anger when these deaths occur
Which brings us back to the Amnesty proposal
The Arab League on Wednesday postponed a reconciliation conference for Iraq that had been set for August. Adnan Ali al-Kadhimi, a top adviser to Maliki, said the conference was delayed in part so Iraq could decide who might be eligible for any amnesty. It was not clear how the government would verify which insurgents have been responsible for which types of attacks.
"The government has in mind somehow to do reconciliation, and one way to do it is to offer an amnesty, but not a sort of unconditional amnesty," Kadhimi said in a telephone interview. "We can see if somehow those who are so-called resistance can be accepted if they have not been involved in any kind of criminal behavior, such as killing innocent people or damaging infrastructure, and even infrastructure if it is minor will be pardoned."
*************************
Asked about clemency for those who attacked U.S. troops, he said: "That's an area where we can see a green line. There's some sort of preliminary understanding between us and the MNF-I," the U.S.-led Multi-National Force-Iraq, "that there is a patriotic feeling among the Iraqi youth and the belief that those attacks are legitimate acts of resistance and defending their homeland. These people will be pardoned definitely, I believe."
And what better way than an amnesty for killing US troops is there for Maliki to try and undercut the insurgents, militias and death squads currently wreaking carnage on an already brutalized populace and presenting such a clear threat to his fledgling Administration?
Unfortunately for President Jr, he's left himself very little wiggle room if this proposal actually comes to pass
The Iraqi people have expressed their desires, and now it's up to the government to follow through.
Does that "follow through" include the amnesty for Iraqis who have targeted and killed US Troops Mr President?
The policy of the United States government is to stand with this new government and help them succeed, and we will do what it takes to help them succeed.
And will "helping them succeed" include enthusiastically signing off on the amnesty proposal should it come to pass Mr President?
The Prime Minister's plan to bring militias and other armed groups under government control is moving forward, and we talked about that plan. He understands how important it is to rein in these militias. Many militia members will be demobilized and integrated into the Iraqi security forces, where they'll be dispersed among different units and, obviously, monitored closely by the government.
Mr President, did you and PM Maliki discuss this amnesty proposal in your oh-so-brief stopover in the Green Zone, and if not, why?
And then there's this
Prime Minister Maliki is working to build confidence in the Iraqi security forces, and he has a plan to do that. To assist him, we'll continue embedding coalition transition teams in Iraqi army and police units. We've deployed advisory teams to assist Iraq's new ministries of -- Ministers of Defense and Interior, both of whom I met. We want to help them build the command and control capacity of their ministries.
So, Mr President, just how will that amnesty proposal fly with the friends and families of US troops-embedded with Iraqi army & police units-killed by insurgents, how does backing an incentive that results in further dead and maimed US troops-amnesty for their attackers-show any Administrative support for those US troops YOU sent into battle?
The President knows exactly what's coming his way here in the US if this amnesty proposal comes to pass, and he knows it's a no-win scenario for both himself and the GOP come the November elections
Q What are your feelings about discussions in the new Iraqi government of amnesty for insurgents?
**************************
The other part of the question?
Q Possible amnesty for insurgents.
THE PRESIDENT: Yes -- I talked to the Prime Minister about -- his question is, possible amnesty. The Prime Minister I think would say "reconciliation." This is an issue that is on the minds of a lot of the folks there in Iraq. In other words, they're trying to figure out how to reconcile an ugly past with a hopeful future. And part of that is reconciliation. I'm not exactly sure how you would -- what you mean by -- if somebody has committed a crime, I don't know whether or not they'll be that lenient, frankly.
Why, Mr President, LOGICALLY, would the Maliki govt punish those Iraqis who have attacked, killed and maimed US troops, seeing as how no US troops have been turned over to the Iraqis for trial regarding alleged US atrocities committed against Iraqi civilians?
President Jr was insistent on launching this invasion and occupation of a country that presented absolutely NO threat to the US in any way, shape or form
The more rabid of his rapidly dwindling starry-eyed true believers/lackeys/sheeple bleat that any criticism of the President, his military policies and strategies, shrieking that any critics undermine troop morale and energize those attacking the US troops in Iraq
Well now, the time is drawing near when the extremely unpleasant reality is about to force them all to choose sides
If they truly support this nascent Iraqi Govt, then they'll have to back any amnesty proposal that rewards those who have attacked, killed and maimed the US Troops the President, Administration and it's backers claim to stand for
If those same people are against this amnesty, then all that lip service about standing with the Iraqis is nothing but the most base and hollow of self-serving rhetoric
And just how does anyone think, logically, those US troops currently or in the future stationed in Iraq should or will react to this proposal, especially if the Administration ends up going along with this amnesty proposal for those who attack, kill and maim US troops?
If anyone is able to show how this President can logically satisfy both the Iraqis and US Troops regarding this amnesty, and further show how it will help the GOP going into the November elections, then please give it a shot
PS
If this proposal becomes a reality in Iraq, does anyone think it won't be sought for in Afghanistan?
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Iraq Amnesty Plan May Cover Attacks On U.S. Military
Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki on Wednesday proposed a limited amnesty to help end the Sunni Arab insurgency as part of a national reconciliation plan that Maliki said would be released within days. The plan is likely to include pardons for those who had attacked only U.S. troops, a top adviser said.
Maliki's declaration of openness to talks with some members of Sunni armed factions, and the prospect of pardons, are concessions that previous, interim governments had avoided. The statements marked the first time a leader from Iraq's governing Shiite religious parties has publicly embraced national reconciliation, welcomed dialogue with armed groups and proposed a limited amnesty.
Reconciliation could include an amnesty for those "who weren't involved in the shedding of Iraqi blood," Maliki told reporters at a Baghdad news conference. "Also, it includes talks with the armed men who opposed the political process and now want to turn back to political activity."
*************************
Maliki's security crackdown and talk of amnesty and reconciliation came a day after President Bush's unannounced visit to Baghdad's heavily fortified Green Zone. Bush came with what he said were twin messages for Maliki: The United States would not abandon Iraq, but Iraq needed to do more to tackle its problems.
And one of the big problems Maliki has been forced to respond to are numerous instances of Iraqi civilians being killed, wrongly or deliberately, by US forces.
Maliki has insisted that Iraq will conduct it's own investigations into these incidents, and one reason for that is as a way to undercut the simmering and explicit anger when these deaths occur
Which brings us back to the Amnesty proposal
The Arab League on Wednesday postponed a reconciliation conference for Iraq that had been set for August. Adnan Ali al-Kadhimi, a top adviser to Maliki, said the conference was delayed in part so Iraq could decide who might be eligible for any amnesty. It was not clear how the government would verify which insurgents have been responsible for which types of attacks.
"The government has in mind somehow to do reconciliation, and one way to do it is to offer an amnesty, but not a sort of unconditional amnesty," Kadhimi said in a telephone interview. "We can see if somehow those who are so-called resistance can be accepted if they have not been involved in any kind of criminal behavior, such as killing innocent people or damaging infrastructure, and even infrastructure if it is minor will be pardoned."
*************************
Asked about clemency for those who attacked U.S. troops, he said: "That's an area where we can see a green line. There's some sort of preliminary understanding between us and the MNF-I," the U.S.-led Multi-National Force-Iraq, "that there is a patriotic feeling among the Iraqi youth and the belief that those attacks are legitimate acts of resistance and defending their homeland. These people will be pardoned definitely, I believe."
And what better way than an amnesty for killing US troops is there for Maliki to try and undercut the insurgents, militias and death squads currently wreaking carnage on an already brutalized populace and presenting such a clear threat to his fledgling Administration?
Unfortunately for President Jr, he's left himself very little wiggle room if this proposal actually comes to pass
The Iraqi people have expressed their desires, and now it's up to the government to follow through.
Does that "follow through" include the amnesty for Iraqis who have targeted and killed US Troops Mr President?
The policy of the United States government is to stand with this new government and help them succeed, and we will do what it takes to help them succeed.
And will "helping them succeed" include enthusiastically signing off on the amnesty proposal should it come to pass Mr President?
The Prime Minister's plan to bring militias and other armed groups under government control is moving forward, and we talked about that plan. He understands how important it is to rein in these militias. Many militia members will be demobilized and integrated into the Iraqi security forces, where they'll be dispersed among different units and, obviously, monitored closely by the government.
Mr President, did you and PM Maliki discuss this amnesty proposal in your oh-so-brief stopover in the Green Zone, and if not, why?
And then there's this
Prime Minister Maliki is working to build confidence in the Iraqi security forces, and he has a plan to do that. To assist him, we'll continue embedding coalition transition teams in Iraqi army and police units. We've deployed advisory teams to assist Iraq's new ministries of -- Ministers of Defense and Interior, both of whom I met. We want to help them build the command and control capacity of their ministries.
So, Mr President, just how will that amnesty proposal fly with the friends and families of US troops-embedded with Iraqi army & police units-killed by insurgents, how does backing an incentive that results in further dead and maimed US troops-amnesty for their attackers-show any Administrative support for those US troops YOU sent into battle?
The President knows exactly what's coming his way here in the US if this amnesty proposal comes to pass, and he knows it's a no-win scenario for both himself and the GOP come the November elections
Q What are your feelings about discussions in the new Iraqi government of amnesty for insurgents?
**************************
The other part of the question?
Q Possible amnesty for insurgents.
THE PRESIDENT: Yes -- I talked to the Prime Minister about -- his question is, possible amnesty. The Prime Minister I think would say "reconciliation." This is an issue that is on the minds of a lot of the folks there in Iraq. In other words, they're trying to figure out how to reconcile an ugly past with a hopeful future. And part of that is reconciliation. I'm not exactly sure how you would -- what you mean by -- if somebody has committed a crime, I don't know whether or not they'll be that lenient, frankly.
Why, Mr President, LOGICALLY, would the Maliki govt punish those Iraqis who have attacked, killed and maimed US troops, seeing as how no US troops have been turned over to the Iraqis for trial regarding alleged US atrocities committed against Iraqi civilians?
President Jr was insistent on launching this invasion and occupation of a country that presented absolutely NO threat to the US in any way, shape or form
The more rabid of his rapidly dwindling starry-eyed true believers/lackeys/sheeple bleat that any criticism of the President, his military policies and strategies, shrieking that any critics undermine troop morale and energize those attacking the US troops in Iraq
Well now, the time is drawing near when the extremely unpleasant reality is about to force them all to choose sides
If they truly support this nascent Iraqi Govt, then they'll have to back any amnesty proposal that rewards those who have attacked, killed and maimed the US Troops the President, Administration and it's backers claim to stand for
If those same people are against this amnesty, then all that lip service about standing with the Iraqis is nothing but the most base and hollow of self-serving rhetoric
And just how does anyone think, logically, those US troops currently or in the future stationed in Iraq should or will react to this proposal, especially if the Administration ends up going along with this amnesty proposal for those who attack, kill and maim US troops?
If anyone is able to show how this President can logically satisfy both the Iraqis and US Troops regarding this amnesty, and further show how it will help the GOP going into the November elections, then please give it a shot
PS
If this proposal becomes a reality in Iraq, does anyone think it won't be sought for in Afghanistan?
posted by KingCranky II at
12:34 AM
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